SUPERHUMAN????

LOOK.... UP IN THE SKY!!! IT'S A CROSSFITTER!

At the time of this writing, there are six people (3 men/3 women) claiming 600+ reps for Workout #2 of the CrossFit Games Open. The workout is as many rounds as possible in 15 minutes of 9 deadlifts (M:155#/W:100#)/12 push-ups with a hand raise at bottom/15 box jumps (M:24"/W:20"). Yes, you read that right.... 600 or more reps! For the purpose of this post, I will use an even 600 reps. To achieve 600 reps, a person would have to perform 16 rounds + 9 deadlifts + 12 push-ups + 3 box jumps...in 15 minutes!!! WOW!

Time for some math (YAY)!!! There are 900 seconds in 15 minutes. 900 seconds divided by 600 reps is 1.5 seconds per rep. At 1.5 seconds per rep, in order to complete 600 reps you would have to finish a round every 54 seconds without any rest or transition time. WOW! 

I figure that even if you drop the bar on your last deadlift and flop right down to a push-up AND you jumped out of the push-up burpee style for the box jumps, you still have a total of 2-3 seconds of transition time between movements per round. That means in 16+ rounds, You would lose anywhere from 34-51 seconds of transition time total over the course of 15 minutes. 

Let's say the transition time is on the low side at 34 seconds. That means the total seconds that you are actually completing 600 reps shrinks down to 1.4 seconds per rep. You are now completing a round every 50.4 seconds without any rest. WOW!

I did an "air round": A simulated straight leg deadlift with no bar or stick, push-ups without raising my hands, and standing jumps with no box or tuck (about an 8"-10" jump). I made sure I hit full range of motion on the "air deadlift" and the push-up. It took me 40 seconds to complete the round. That means to achieve 600 reps, I would only have 10.4 seconds of rest time, or what I call "wiggle room", per round to maintain pace. And remember, that is with no weight, no hand raise, and no box. WOW!

Please don't get me wrong. I am not outright calling anyone a bullshitter, but is 600+ reps AT FULL RANGE OF MOTION PER THE MOVEMENT STANDARDS really possible? I truly believe that a person can have a big cardiovascular engine, but you gotta admit, these numbers are nuts!! I wish just one of those 600+ rep performances was on video because that would be something worth watching. 600 reps at full range of motion is a serious work output. I'd love to see someone do the real math and figure out what the work output was in horsepower or something like that.

CrossFit has gone crazy. I remember when Jason Khalipa won the 2008 CrossFit Games and everyone thought he was a juggernaut who would never be beat. Last year he took 16th place at the CrossFit Games! I remember when a person with a sub 3 minute "Fran" was a freak of nature, and now I have people telling me that they routinely see attendees hitting sub-3 minute Fran times at the Level I Trainer Certifications. 

Pretty soon, I am expecting a CrossFitter to have the ability to fly. We shall see.....  

Post thoughts to comments.

*****************************************************

WORKOUT   4/4/2011

Start a seven minute running clock. Perform one thruster (M:135#/W:95#), then one pull-up. Then do two thrusters/two pull-ups, three thrusters/three pull-ups, etc. Continue until the seven minutes expires.

How far up the ladder can you get??

*****************************************************

Comments

[Chris]

While this post was about some of the impressive yet odd numbers being put up by games competitors, I'd imagine that a relatively substantial portion of the cheating is occurring in places 10-60. There is absolutely zero advantage to post large enough numbers to win any individual sectional WOD.
Winning will bring a great deal of increased scrutiny at the regional competition. Keep in mind you don't have to win sectionals or regionals, only the games.

Hell, if I were competing and I had a friendly affiliate I wouldn't even do the sectional WODs. I'd wait till the deadline was close, survey the performances, and pick a number that would get me in approximately the middle of the pack. I'd just continue my strength and conditioning such that I'd peak at the games, not for some horseshit sectional WOD.

[Meris]

Great post, while it isn't a perfect solution at least the current wod is simple to judge. Hopefully that will continue for the rest of the open and next year they will go back to sectional competitions with real judges

[Andrea Ager]

Hey CrossFit OneWorld!
I agree with your post about full range of motion. I agree that it would be very easy to cheat some moves without posting a video for the games. However that is assuming these "superhero Crossfitters" are either 1. Dishonest or 2. don't know/care about the rules. CrossFit is progressing just like anything else!
In 1954 no one ever thought anyone would break a 4 minute mile. Roger Bannister shattered it and within a few months 6 people did it after. Impossible is possible! Not everyone "needs a break" in a 15 minute workout. Sweet math though.
Andrea Ager
#6 in 2nd games wod

[Roland]

Freddy, awesome post. The only video that I have seen with big numbers (Dan Bailey’s 575 WOD) was this one: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mie3Z-5vk2w His performance is impressive but - according to the standards - he does not fully extend his hips on the box jumps and his body is nowhere straight in the pushups. Just fast forward to the last few rounds. This is not bad per se (as the workload is awesome) but does not adhere to the standards as prescribed. I do - however - agree that this will not change the ultimate "fittest in the world" ranking in the least.

Freddy, I hope you will come visit Cape Town at some stage!

[Robin - CrossFit Regina]

Great write-up Freddy! I am an affiliate owner up in Canada. I was led here today by the comments under yet another article on the Games website defending the snaking push-ups (calling them "harmless errors"). It is really unfortunate that we affiliates that are upholding the standards are actually being PUNISHED for doing so.

And to the ones that asked for heavy thrusters in the comments here, YOU GOT IT THIS WEEK!!!

[Crockett]

I whole heartedily agree with your post Freddy. I think some of the numbers people are posting are outlandish.

The fact of the matter is there is no such thing as a competition without some human error in judging, scoring, or someone that is trying to cheat the system. Look at the NFL and Collegiate football introducing replay (and there are still botched calls on a routine basis).

I hate the way the games are being ran this year because I like to compete against others in person. At the same point, I don't fault HQ for what they are doing. The problems being raised would happen regardless.

Just compete, do your best, and don't sweat the things you cannot control. Most of us will not make it to the Games, so what matters in the end is how did "you" do for "you."

[Melodia]

Well, looks like todays Open WOD should clean out some of this BS. 165lb clean and jerk for reps is no joke. I weigh 130 and have a hard fought for, 700 powerlifting total and so I consider myself a strong female... but I can just barely C & J my bodyweight. This should be innneresting.

[Wade in Denver]

@maddy: You are correct, human beings cannot move that fast, for that long, and maintain correct rom. Period. As we have seen in our current sports world, when money is on the line, people will do anything to succeed. Integrity is a lost art my friends. I thought CF was based on integrity of movement? At least until Reebok backed up the money truck, it was.

[maddy grunwald]

LMFAO @ Scott B arguing that this is possible. If you're superman, it is possible. You're arguing that it is possible since Speal did 38 rounds of Cindy. Speal didn't do 16 rounds of the 11.2 WOD. The second example you give is a workout with deadlifts, box jumps and no pushups. Again, a bad example. The best way to prove it is impossible is to do what Freddy did which is to see how fast you can complete a unweighted round with a jump instead of a box jump. Humans can not move fast enough to do 17 rounds of this workout in 15 minutes. Not possible. It's a obvious case of cheating. CASE CLOSED!

[Eric in Denver]

Been reading all the comments & thought I'd throw in a minor point: My take on the "no reps for chest not touching" would be that his shoulders were back when he hit the ground (almost in a yoga pose, but probably not that severe) so that his stomach touched without his actual chest touching. Just a thought, and put me firmly in the skeptical camp.

[@sushi]

Damn it, Alex. I just realized that you beat me to the smart-ass comment. And at a better number. I suck.

[Scott B]

I am not sure if this supports my belief that 600 is a viable number but it does add some interesting information to the discussion. The range of motion argument seems to be our primary difference. Judging in a traditional sectional is different than judging in a in-house sectional.

The 2010 Iceland Sectionals had the following workout (wod #3)
3 rounds of
5 Deadlifts (135kg / 80kg)
20 Box jumps (24" / 20") [am I the only person that thinks it is wierd that they use inches for box jumps in Iceland :) ]

The top male athlete was 2:21 (1 rep per 1.88 sec, ignoring transitions) That is a difference in 0.38 sec per rep

The top female athlete was 2:05 (1 rep per 1.67 sec, ignoring transitions). That is a difference of 0.17 sec per rep

The 600 score one WOD 1.2 requires 1 rep per 1.5 seconds, ignoring transitions.

A couple things to keep in mind.
- The sample size for the Iceland sectionals appears to be 40 athletes (27 males and 14 females). I believe that the current sample size for sectionals is over 15,000 athletes. As you increase the sample size you increase the probability that you find some genetic freak that God made just for that workout.
- The Iceland WOD was a sanctioned sectionals WOD so I would assume that the athletes were held to a legit ROM.
- For WOD 1.2, athletes had a chance to discuss strategy & repeat the workout over a number of days. I know I tend to benefit from discussing a WOD with people that have already completed it.
- the Iceland WOD was quite a bit shorter (2 to 3 min) vs. 15 min. (this does not support my argument but it is important to include)

My only point is that the WOD 1.2 score of 600 is not crazy. It is amazing but possible. Do you think that given a 15,000 athletes, you could find one athlete that could do that Iceland WOD in 1:52 (1.5 sec per rep)? I think it is possible.

[freddy c.]

Scott, It actually doesn't work out and the reason is 38 is a awesome score, but is not a contest score with a supposed ROM standard. I've known Speal a long time now. I've seen plenty of videos of him doing things really fast, but with some very sketch looking movement. 38 rounds of Cindy is not possible without shorting minimally the squat movement. Of course, even 38 rounds with short ROM is fucking crazy impressive.

38 rounds of Cindy yes, but he only humped out a very human 489 reps for this workout.

[Digger22]

But this was before they started doing hand release pushups and and air squats are going to be much faster then a proper full range of motion deadlift. Plus have you seen Spealler do butterfly pullups...

[Scott B]

I think it is possible.

If I am reading the article correctly, an athlete would need to average 1 rep per 1.4 seconds in order to get 600 reps in wod 1.2

To support my belief that it is possible I am going to use the workout Cindy as an example. Cindy is a 20 min AMRAP of 5 pull-ups, 10 push-ups, 15 squats.

Cindy is a nice comparison since it include pushups, is a longer time domain, and include squats (a larger range of motion then a deadlift).

Chris Spealler has reported a score of 38 rounds. That is 1140 reps. 20 minutes gives him 1200 seconds to complete the reps. If estimate total of 2 seconds of transition time per round then he has 1200 - (2 * 38) = 1124. That means he has to complete 1140 reps in 1124 seconds.

This means he has to complete each rep in less than a second (0.986 seconds). Remember, the article says a 600 requires 1 rep per 1.4 seconds. If someone can average 1 rep per second for Cindy, I think it is plausible that someone can average 1 rep per 1.4 seconds for WOD 1.2

reference: http://games2009.crossfit.com/competitors/athlete-profile-chris-spealler.html

[Alex]

Excellent post. @Brian, agree with the 'no-rep for chest not touching the ground' comment! Seems odd to me too. Theres a new site up that allows you to search, build and share custom Crossfit Open leaderboards. http://games.wodhopper.com. I am using it to watch all these crazy scores on one page.

[Dan Williams]

A good question Brian, and not one I can answer. I'm sure if you raise the question on the interview you will get a response from someone more qualified to answer.

[Brian]

@Dan W - I find it interesting in the interview with Jean-Claude with the question about 'no reps' called against him that he said "Not all my reps were counted I stumbled on the box jumps and a few reps on the pushups for chest not touching the ground."

How is it possible to no rep for chest not touching the ground if you are lifting your hands up on each one?

[Brian]

@Dan U - I want to make sure you guys are watching the right guy in that video. Dan Bailey is the one in RED. He's not even in the video until about 20 seconds in. Granted, the video angle is such that there's no way of telling his ROM for DL, but you can see the majority of push-ups and box jumps.

Are those not legitimate PUs and BJs?

[Dan Williams]

Check out an interview with Jean-Claude Jardim, winner of WOD 11.2 here http://www.rangeofmotion.net.au/blog/interview-jean-claude-jardim-winner-wod-112

[Fit As F*ck Contender]

What's up with Dan Bailey, did his result count at all?
Man the games is gonna be boring if these guys make it there.
As long as the previous winners get a free pass we will at least be given the opportunity to see 8 beasts (4m 4f) kick some ass!

[alex]

the 100th comment will receive a crossfitoneworld t-shit with the fit as fuk logo

[Dan Uyemura]

@Brian Re: Dan Bailey. I watched 13 seconds and ZERO DEADLIFTS are valid. NO FUCKING REP ON 9 STRAIGHT.

Go watch the "standards" of movement on this WOD. "Shoulders behind bar".

I stop wasting my time on this garbage at 14 seconds.

[@sushi]

This is the 78th comment on this post...... that is all.

[Stephen @ Cincinnati Strength]

I've been posting similar thoughts around the Internet since before the Open even started, and unfortunately they all came true. Horrible format, horrible standards, and a clear lack of intelligent thought once again from HQ.

Just wanted to let you know that most are in agreement with you...

[billy]

Brian, are you being sarcastic about the ROM in that video? The deads were horrific, 99% of the pushups were unsat, no extension on the box jumps. That was 100% slop!

[brad]

Jnel, great comment

[Brian]

http://www.sicfit.com/coverage/238561-The-2011-Reebok-CrossFit-Games/video/482813-Dan-Bailey-CF-Legacy-gets-nearly-16-rounds-on-112

ROM looks pretty good here and it's almost 16 rounds. He slowed on the pushups toward the last rounds, but if he kept up a little higher pace, he could have seen 600.

[Peg Glassleg]

Lincoln Brigham could do 700 reps, he just doesn't want to.

How do you compare a champion from one year to the champion from another year?

[Alex]

I just wanted to make the 69th comment! that is all.

[Pat]

You are the man!!!

[Moe G.]

Great post! It's good to see that there are so many of us that feel the same way. I hope that the lesson is learned. What sucks is that there have been quality honest athletes that have been working to compete in the games that will never have the opportunity due to cheaters.

[bob]

The open has been going on for 3 weeks and they still don't have the web site fixed. That says all that needs to be said about the open. They have a LOT of bugs in their plan. Many people warned HQ about the potential for cheating. Coach addressed the concern in a video and simply said the cheaters would eventually be uncovered. Too bad he didn't realize how widespread cheating would be and how massive cheating discredits the entire open.

[Ken Gall @ CFATL]

Great post. Either the capabilities of the average crossfitter has improved dramatically, or the majority of these scores are with terrible ROM....

[tim]

I saw at least 4 people at our gym get counted for rocking, snake style push-ups...

These people beat the people that did the push-ups using the strict standard... kinda funny that the people doing the push-ups the right way, and who would normally be the best at the gym, get beat pretty badly by people that did the push-ups the wrong way...

The only way to fix this is to throw round 2 results out...or to add another week and say that rocking, snake style push-ups are ok!

[Jnel]

As long as this "elite sport" doesnt come with legit judging and competition format.... It will become a joke. Even watching crossfits "elite" competitors make fran look like a retard circus act at the arnold classic is not helping the situation. I like hq, i like crossfit and will continue training in hopes of increasing my fitness. But i refuse to cut corners and reps to make myself and the sport look pathetic. In mma, if you screw up in a fight, you get knocked out. In crossfit, when you screw up...... Ah hell it dont matter, as long as that $hits sub 3.

[Marcus Herou]

Agree. I did almost 12 rounds. All DL & BJs unbroken. Pshps broken but kept to the standard. The hardest part was to maintain "plank" after your legs started to scream "please rest a little on the floor". I have seen videos from within affiliates that have submitted scores and they contain bullshit reps which really makes me angry.

DLs with no extension what so ever.
Pshps on the knees! <- this is the worst I think and is what they cheat mostly in.
BJs no extension on the top.

I did it at the same time as the beast Alexander Alexandrov which did almost 14 rounds which I thought was crazy. He did the pshps 10+2 all the way through and the last 3 rounds he increased speed. 15 rounds ? Yeah that is the limit. I cannot figure out how they can be more than 100 reps faster that Alexander.

Lastly. I did a little calculation test of my own.

If you are a LEGIT CF:er divide your score of WOD 2 with WOD 1 and compare to the ones who claim 550+ reps. They have a MUCH higher ratio. The ratio of the top 100 should be +- the same but it is not.

I was 350 in WOD 1 and 1300 in WOD 2 and the thing is that I am quite happy with my performance in WOD 2! I mean that is like a 1000 placement difference.

Many friends of mine who are great athletes feel the same way. Something does not add up.

Reason ? It is harder to cheat in WOD 1. I mean even if you do not do 100% correct Snatches, the bar must travel a hell of a long way. The DU's are what they are. So if you did all your reps there is no way that you will get past 10 rounds.

Hoping for heavy stuff to rule these fuckers out.

[Leon- CrossFit Elysium]

Dan- this. I posted something similar on the games facebook page. We circumvented this issue at the SD/AZ sectionals in 2010 by simply stating chest must touch the ground at the bottom (there was a button that made noise to ensure this) and the movement ends fully locked out in all planes. Define point A and point B, how you get there is up to you. No one says "a legit deadlift must start on the ground, no rounding of the back, bar must be no further than 1 in from the legs, no looking up/down, etc". They simply say- bar starts on the floor, ends at the hips, fully locked out.

The standards for this last WOD betray an utter lack of experience and knowledge re: human performance, intensity and degradation of form with pushups. I don't care who you are. Eventually EVERYONE will snake to a certain degree. EVERYONE's chest will rise faster than the hips at some point. To expect otherwise, and to put standards that ignore this FACT of high rep pushups, speaks volumes about the lack of thought going into the programming.

[dan]

For an example close to 600 just watch the guy kacee from Hungary, I think you'll get a picture of what it looks like to sacrifice standards for points. Heck coach always said men would die for points, cheating for points is much less sacrifice, or is it?

[Dan Hollingsworth - Kitsap CrossFit]

In hindsight, I think the best approach for this would have been to say "We don't care what happens in the middle, but you must start in a full locked out plank, end up prone and lift your hands off the deck and then finish in a full locked out plank." As CrossFitters we accept and expect that form will degrade during a WOD. As long as you meet the ROM standards, then it's fair for everybody. They do the same thing with the burpee because form during the movement is nearly impossible to regulate and standardize. Too much emphasis was placed on what happens during the movement, IMHO.

[Anne-Marie]

I think what needs to be defined here is what a disqualifying factor is... In most sports it's a false start, overstepping the line, improper turn, knocking something down, etc.

What is disqualifying in CrossFit? As far as I can see in the games competition it's not achieving a full-range of motion. As far as form - nobody cares (in competition that is) For example one of the greatest long distance swimmers, Janet Evans, who held a world record over 20 years had the worst stroke but she was damn fast!

The problem is... No standardization in referees, no accountability in WOD verification, and just too many damn people competing for anyone to watch 1,000s of videos on a daily basis to count legitamate reps.

Another point... I think only in recreational golf is an athlete allowed a mulligan. So allowing someone several chances to try their event seems slightly odd.

The whole purpose on this world wide internet event was to allow "everyone" the ability to compete and allow HQ to really coin the "fittest people on earth". Great idea with a gamit of flaws! The problem here is obvious in everyone's post...There is a huge lack of consistancy, a lack of standardized judging,a myriad of movement interpretations, and a compilation of WOD's that increase the margin of error in all facets (judging, athletic performance,etc).

Frustrated....YES! But I still have yet to watch the games on ESPN, at the Olympics, or root for my favorite college CrossFit team at the NCAA championships. When and if this ever happens you better believe that there will be standardized judging, ref'ing, movements, etc. But I bet if that happens there will be height, weight, and age divisions!

Thanks for the post Freddy!

[umpire]

None of the males who proved themselves in last year's competition cracked 16 and you have a guy with 17+ and 3 with 16+. They cheated. Spealler didn't even do 14 rounds.

[Dan Uyemura]

Keith -
Per the RULES. if you submit a video and the person judging you / keeping you honest doesn't no rep you, and you submit a video with ONE bad rep - the entire workout is voided. Them's the rules.

to win $2011, I sincerely think you HAVE to submit a video with 100% valid reps. And since anyone with any fighting shot at winning would submit out of economic incentive, we'd alleviate the whole "is-the-cream-that-is-rising-to-the-top-really-shit" issue.

[Chris]

Does anyone ACTUALLY disagree with this post? I love that someone had the balls to publically post what so many of us are thinking. I just hope a legit athlete with talent & a calculator that adds properly doesn't miss their chance at regionals bc some douche bag signed his buddy off on poor rom.

While I do like being able to attempt the workout twice, it's not real life. How many pro NFL players get to say "whoops, missed that pass. Hey, Gimmie a do over".

[Lisa]

Great post, Freddy - I did this on Thursday with full ROM & got just under 10 rounds. Then I saw what the judges were allowing during our Saturday citywide, & I did it again with rockabilly push-ups and bunnyhop (not fully extended) boxjumps. 13 rounds. It reconfirmed why I have no intentions of competing at regionals: crossfit is not a competitive sport. It's the best conditioning program in the universe, no doubt, but it's just not a sport.

[Brandon]

You can't cheat range of motion when the zombies attack. The ones doing the real work will survive. ;)

I agree, we need to see some videos. If anything just so our jaws can drop and admire.

[Chris]

Imagine someone trying to qualify for the Olympics or any other world wide competition in this manner.
Without strict standards and live sanctioned competitions along with properly trained judges this whole process is just laughable.

I love what CrossFit has done for the fitness community. I also love watching the elite compete on the benchmark workouts. However I think this endeavor is just a money making machine for HQ.

[Dave]

It's not anti-HQ, it's pro-quality. We want a quality event with quality standards, enforced fairly. Using pushups in an event was doomed from the start and you, as a veteran athlete knew it right? Just because HQ is the only game in town doesn't make them any good at what they do with regard to managing the Games. How can you call out people's numbers and not doubt the people in charge for remaining silent, when it is their job to police them? And bagging on HQ will always be soooo today as long as they keep mismanaging their showcase event.

Freddy, you're article has gone viral. It's that good. That being said, I'll take my debate somewhere else now. Thanks for having me.

*the opinions expressed in this post are not shared by Crossfit OneWorld...yet.

[freddy c.]

I missed the part where this became an anti-HQ post...... the crossfit juggernaut is here to stay. Bagging on HQ is sooooo yesterday =)

[Dave]

It goes without saying that this wod should be thrown out. It was never fair from the start and this is what happens when people that don't do the workouts try to program them. The real question that needs to be addressed is what next. At some point HQ will pay a price for pissing off it's best and brightest, which are the people like Freddy, that can't stand for inferior product. Enough people will come together and decide to host a real test of work capacity. The only question is when. There are already smart people running a number of great events out there. Eventually we will all organize and we won't need to waste our time complaining about the ignorance and incompetence at HQ.